Disappointing season - thus far

[fishingmachine]

I do think weather was a a big factor later on.
The huge amount of run-off causing dirty water all through May ,June and July make the salmon fishing difficult to say the least,especially around the Otter Creek,Lewis Creek area.

[BottomDollar]

I do think weather was a a big factor later on.
The huge amount of run-off causing dirty water all through May ,June and July make the salmon fishing difficult to say the least,especially around the Otter Creek,Lewis Creek area.

Water clarity was never an issue on most of the broad lake, though, and it was still a terrible year for salmon. It could be a case of them not being where we think they should be, but the spawning counts should tell us if what most of us are experiencing is in fact less fish in the lake. I'm really hoping to be pleasantly surprised by those counts.

[C-Hawk]

While we can't all agree on the causes of the unusual bad year for salmon fishing, it is very obvious that we all agree that it was a bad year. My question is , and I think they must know and also monitor our forum, why have we not heard a single word from our good friends at Fish and Wildlife? They are so forthcoming at our seminars, and always looking to us for input, why have they not responded to this forum , at least to let us know that they "might" also be concerned? If they do not think that cormorants are a problem, then they should say so. If they think they are, then they should do the right thing. I think they at least owe us an opinion as to what they think is going on.

[Sawyer]

I'm with C- Hawk.
Last year i got checked by a creel survey team 3 times on the IS and this year 0 times.

[BottomDollar]

x3. I'd love to just hear some feedback.

I also had zero interactions with the fishery survey folks and I haven't seen a game warden since last spring.

[jimbow]

While we can't all agree on the causes of the unusual bad year for salmon fishing, it is very obvious that we all agree that it was a bad year. My question is , and I think they must know and also monitor our forum, why have we not heard a single word from our good friends at Fish and Wildlife? They are so forthcoming at our seminars, and always looking to us for input, why have they not responded to this forum , at least to let us know that they "might" also be concerned? If they do not think that cormorants are a problem, then they should say so. If they think they are, then they should do the right thing. I think they at least owe us an opinion as to what they think is going on.

C-Hawk, you are spot on. This year has been horrible, it seems worse since we can all agree how great last year was in comparison. With that fresh in our minds, I got a feeling last season that something might be up because we were catching so many really great fish (in size & numbers) and very few "dinks". I asked them (F & W) a question at the seminar in March of this year about the cormorants...They are obviously aware of problems...and they sort of agreed that the birds are not good for the fishery...However, they said their hands are tied (with Cormorants) until the Feds let them. It was the head honcho that responded, he was very nice but could not respond further, and that was BEFORE we all discovered how bad this year turned out to be. I'm sure they will get an earful next time they show up at a seminar, but then what can we do to get them to respond to our complaints is another thing. I hate to pound a dead horse, but there has to be a way or time of year to stock the fish that will give them the advantage they need to get to catch-able size. Hairbone said in his Lake George thread that one of the reasons why the salmon are coming back there is volunteers doing the stocking "at sea". I'm sure we could get enough volunteers on Champlain to do that too, they can be dispersed so they wouldn't be in one "bait ball" making it easy for the feathered menace to pick them off. The next thing is to stock bigger fish that can swim deeper after stocking. I heard somewhere that the air bladders in the younger fish are not developed or capable of letting them dive deep enough to get away from the cormorants and sea gulls. Anyone know if this is true? I'm sure if we all put our heads together we can give the F & W people some possible solutions, not just questions and complaints.

[Sawyer]

X2

[Reelax]

I think the experts are as puzzled as we are... like has been said. The spawning counts at the lifts will really be telling this year. Numbers have been down but we put 8 different people on personal best salmon from 6-11.2lbs this year. So for me is was a great year.

Would really love to hear from some fish and wildlife folks even if they are puzzled.

[dry net]

I am far from an expert but if everyone is in agreement that the salmon numbers lake wide are down wouldn't it be reasonable to close the the salmonoid fishing for the season? Probably not popular but less pressure hopefully equals more fish come spring. Unlimited fishing and seemingly unlimited tournaments could be part of the overall problem. Just my two cents and no I am no Dick Baker!

[C-Hawk]

The catch rate has steadily increased for the last 15 years, while the seasons have remained the same as well as the number of tournaments. I think fishing pressure goes up and down with numbers of fish. There could be a little bit of an issue with numbers of fishermen per available fish, but this would show up as more of a cyclic thing rather than an out right crash. Also limiting fishing opportunity to spring fishing would not be fair to frostbiters, many of whom only fish the cold months. I would argue for an institution of possession limits, as I don't even see it mentioned in the abstracts. Many states the possesion limit is the same as the bag limit.

[Thorny]

You can't catch what isn't there! It is not my intention to be negative. Just analyzing my experiences. Last fall we had very few Smolts(fish stocked in spring,1 year olds)but we had some. I knew we were in trouble. I believe cormorant predation got them.This spring was OK with some great 4-5 year olds,but very low numbers of 2 year olds(last spring stocks). After a spring of heavy fishing pressure and Derbys. The few fish we have left are very scattered in a very large lake. Let's not forget Lamprey,fewer fish for them to target. This spring I watched flocks of cormorants devouring fish like never before. This fall we have no smolts!(fish that were stocked this spring). That means next spring we will have no 2 year olds. Very few 3 year olds. Our Salmon fishery is only a 4 year process. Salmon don't live past 5. They are put in at 1. In my opinion this Salmon fishery will not survive without Aggressive Cormorant Control!

[Wdrnr]

To add to this a bit, a quick trip by hatchery brook this weekend again showed very little return action thus far. There was just one fish in the pool below the road. I have never seen a fish on this lake as beat up as this salmon was. Looked like a post spawn king about to die. If the fisheries folks retrieved this one they might find something new in terms of sickness. Something is going on lake wide, stocking numbers down, disease, genetics change, it can't be just the birds....

[Thorny]

I hope I'm wrong about the birds. But seeing is believing. I spend approx 30 days on the water between mid March and June. I fish from Isle LeMotte to the Bridge. The size of the Flocks and the feeding frenzys I have witnessed the last 2 years make me a believer at this point. Most of the Salmon I have seen regardless of age have been very healthy besides the Lamprey Hits. Again I hope I'm wrong. I'm sure fish and game would love to find another answer. Because Cormorant Control is not in their control. But their silence at this point tells me they don't have any answers. Witch leads me back to where I started. Control the Cormorants.

[ThreeBuoys]

It will be very interesting to see what happens later this Fall and during Frostbite Season.

[Captain Paul]

You can't catch what isn't there! It is not my intention to be negative. Just analyzing my experiences. Last fall we had very few Smolts(fish stocked in spring,1 year olds)but we had some. I knew we were in trouble. I believe cormorant predation got them.This spring was OK with some great 4-5 year olds,but very low numbers of 2 year olds(last spring stocks). After a spring of heavy fishing pressure and Derbys. The few fish we have left are very scattered in a very large lake. Let's not forget Lamprey,fewer fish for them to target. This spring I watched flocks of cormorants devouring fish like never before. This fall we have no smolts!(fish that were stocked this spring). That means next spring we will have no 2 year olds. Very few 3 year olds. Our Salmon fishery is only a 4 year process. Salmon don't live past 5. They are put in at 1. In my opinion this Salmon fishery will not survive without Aggressive Cormorant Control!

I agree 100 percent with you Rob you can not catch what does not survive and Cormorants are the number 1 problem I believe